Reason #483 Why We Need Smaller Government
By Blue Collar Muse Posted in Miscellanea — Comments (19) / Email this page » / Leave a comment »
So, I got this letter late last week from the IRS. The only thing worse would have been to hear Mike Wallace and the "60 Minutes" crew were filming on my front lawn. Come to think of it, even that may not be worse ...
The letter was computer generated, thanking me for my recent correspondence with them. It said they had not responded yet as they had not finished preparing a "complete response" and that it would be forthcoming within 45 days. It reminded me the installment agreement I agreed to for payment of my taxes was still in effect and I should still make my scheduled payments. It even helpfully included an 800# I could call if I had any questions.
It was a polite, encouraging and downright personable piece of communication. But there was one teensy-weensy lil' problem. I had not recently corresponded with them for any reason other than to mail a check on April 14 for the entire amount of the taxes they wanted from me. There was no installment agreement agreed to and no scheduled payments. Had this been a business like a credit card company saying I had not paid my bill, I wouldn't worry. I'd just call their 800# and get this straightened out. Did I mention this letter was from the IRS?
Still, it was such a NICE letter and they had included an 800#. I called on Saturday but they were closed. To be fair, I don't remember if they were closed because it was Saturday, allowing taxpayers across the country to breathe more easily, or if I just called after hours on Saturday. Regardless I didn't speak to the nice folks at the IRS that day. I laid the letter in my inbox to call this week. Yesterday, I saw the letter and decided I had the time to spend on hold and to deal with any bureaucratic red tape. I dialed the phone.
After about 15 minutes on hold, a nice lady answered, giving me her name and ID#. I explained about the letter and that there was an important looking reference number at the very top which I felt sure linked to a file with all my details in it and we could get this taken care of quickly. The nice IRS lady told me, "No, I don't need that. What's your Social Security number?" I gave it to her and she explained we would have to do a quick Q&A to establish my identity. 5 minutes later we agreed that I was me.
She asked why I was calling. I explained about the letter and the 45 days and the installment agreement and that I didn't recall doing any of those things. The nice IRS lady told me, "According to my screen, you're right. You don't owe any tax, we've released your stimulus package payment and there's no installment agreement!" Relieved, I said, "Great! So you'll take care of this for me?" She helpfully said, "I sure will. I'll just send an email to the person who sent you the letter and have him call you. It will be sometime in the next 30 days. He'll need to make sure this is not a mistake on our part. Where can he reach you?"
I asked to contact the person myself. I explained my concern that, if it took the full 30 days, and if the IRS decided I owed the money, there would be interest and penalties. Since, if I disputed the decision, I had to prove I didn't owe it, and not the other way around, I'd probably just pay the money. When dealing with people who can padlock your home and business, freeze your accounts and generally make life inconvenient, it is often wiser to simply pay them. It's called the "Let the Wookie win!" strategy.
The nice IRS lady assured me there was no cause for alarm. She could see on her screen I owed them nothing! When I again asked her why, if that was the case, could she not clear this up, she again told me it was to be sure that it was not a mistake on their part. I took this to mean the nice IRS lady was positive I didn't owe any money but the person sending me the letter might feel differently. After all, the letter talked about payments and agreements and such. I again expressed the desire to speak to the person who sent me the letter. The nice IRS lady said she could not give me that person's name or contact information. She could not give me his ID#. She wasn't even sure he was a he. She did have an IRS designator identifying exactly who he was but she couldn't give me that, either. But I was not to worry, she would send that email and he would contact me within 30 days.
I surprised myself with boldness and asked why the IRS provided an 800# which connected to a department completely unable to help me. The nice IRS lady gently corrected me. "But I HAVE helped you!", she said. Baffled, I asked, "You have?" "Yes", she responded, "I sent an email to the person who will contact you!" As God is my witness, I actually waited for her to continue, "Just kidding! Just a little IRS humor!" After a long moment in which she did not, in fact, admit to pulling my leg, I asked, "Do you mean this is the extent of the assistance available to me at this number, which, I feel compelled to add, the IRS itself directed me to call if I had questions?" The nice IRS lady replied in the affirmative.
I noted that, as a small business owner, if a customer might need to speak to me I simply gave them MY number. It tended to expedite things. I allowed while it was possible I might miss his call and need to call back, I would not, in fact, set up an entire department whose sole purpose was to email me that someone I thought might need me, actually did, so I could add a call back to him to my calendar sometime in the next 30 days. There being little more to be said, I wished the nice IRS lady a good afternoon and we ended the call.
This sort of inefficiency, waste and duplication is typical of big government. And yet this is the plan we have for Health Care? For Energy Independence? For Education? For Retirement? For the most important things in life? Only in government could a person be of absolutely no assistance whatsoever and, at the same time, take pride in a job well done.
I really hope my installment payments aren't too much ...
but I would verify that the phone number is a legimate phone number for the real IRS. It sounds just like how a scam works. you possibly just gave out all your info. It is a policy to let you know who will be calling or to give you a number to call back. Most scams will not give you this, so they can nnot be found out.
The letter and envelope certainly looked proper. Now I have uet another thing to worry about.
My only consolation is that I wouldn't want to be those guys if the IRS catches them impersonating them ...
Smaller Government! Lower Taxes! Stronger Defense! More Liberty!
It appears in a search of the IRS.gov site and is connected to the "Installment Agreement" form. In fact, the number actually appears on that form on the site's rendition.
Never scare me like that again. If there's anything worse than the IRS wanting to talk to you it's bad people impersonating the IRS wanting to talk to you.
Although, per the old joke about thieves, credit cards and why the husband didn't cancel the stolen card, perhaps the bad people would actually take less from me than the government ...
Smaller Government! Lower Taxes! Stronger Defense! More Liberty!
and I'd imagine that you give your customers a bill of sale or receipt of some sort, and you keep a copy of said receipt for your records. Wouldn't it be simpler for the IRS send out some sort of receipt and keep another copy for their records, rather than having all this bureaucracy to clear up what is probably a mix up?
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In an insane society, reality is outside of the mainstream.
In an insane society, reality is outside of the mainstream!
Your suggestion would indeed be simpler. It would also be sensible. But we are talking about government here. The federal government, no less!
If they operated sensibly and according to good business practices, Liberalism would come to a screeching halt from lack of funding. Since Liberalism and the federal government are pretty much synonymous these days, we all know what chance we have of that happening.
Smaller Government! Lower Taxes! Stronger Defense! More Liberty!
Your story made my blood pressure spike! There are fewer things worse than a nice letter from the IRS.
Sounds like a scam to me. A letter, call a number, asked for your SSN and personal questions, pretty much get nothing out of it. :-/
However, after one diarist above noted it sounded like a scam, I checked isr.gov and found the number I called on the form for "Installment Agreements". I'm pretty sure it's legit.
Smaller Government! Lower Taxes! Stronger Defense! More Liberty!
Just to be saafe, you should email me your SSN and any persanal infermation that the "ajent" may have ekstracted from you. I'll cheek everything out.
BTW, did I mention that some rich guy here died and wants to send you a bunch of his money?
Anyways....you can reach me at 29Victor@somewhereinnigeria.com. Send this to five of your friends or God will remove your gender and you hate Jesus.
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There would be few things we could do to improve this country more than abolish the IRS.
Flat Tax!
"Broadly speaking, liberalism emphasizes individual rights and equality of opportunity. ... including extensive freedom of thought and speech, limitations on the power of governments, the rule of law, the free exchange of ideas, a market or mixed economy,
The only organization that can actually compute my taxes incorrectly and force me to pay more. I like how they can claim that I had more earnings in a year than I really had.
Now also found at The Minority Report
...So, I got this letter late last week from the NHS.
It reminded me of my gender reassignment surgery scheduled for next week. It even helpfully included an 800# I could call if I had any questions...
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Smaller Government! Lower Taxes! Stronger Defense! More Liberty!
Heh. BTW...great post. A good story well told.
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Your point is (very) funny, but it brings up an ACTUAL problem.
Example: My father is in the VA. in the VA they use your last name and part of your ssn (Even though the VA should have its own numbering system rather than using something as dangerous to make public as the ssn)
Well, his last name is kates, so they call out Kates[number] when they call for him, or on documents and for records in the computer.
There is another Kates with the same numbers that uses the same VA clinic/hospital
My father has been scheduled for a few things that he doesn't need, and likely vice versa.
Now, keep in mind, my father's memory isn't the best... so now EVERY time he gets a letter about an appointment, he has to spend an hour (or two) on the phone trying to make sure that the appointment is for him and not the other guy.
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Dependence is Slavery.
...or any other for that matter.
The press & other lefties go on an on about how horrible things are in the VA system & military hospitals(i.e. Walter Reed), and yet push for socialized healthcare. What is the VA except a proving ground for a national healthcare system?
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a class on tax practice and procedure in the pursuit of a masters in tax law, I can tell you that there was virtually no class session or topic that did not involve me asking the professor something on the order of "is that seriously how they do things?" in a sort of incredulous tone.
I'll give you a more extreme example about how abusive the IRS can be......
First, in a situation that boggles my sense of justice - if the IRS says you owe them money - YOU have to prove they're wrong, unless they are alleging you committed fraud, which they have to prove.
Second, the statute of limitations on taxes is 3 years from when you file your return. So if the government doesn't audit you and allege some sort of deficiency in what you paid within 3 years they can never come after you.
Third, that 3 year limitation can be waived if both you and the IRS agree to give them more time to look at things.
Fourth, if the IRS wants more time, and you're unwilling to give it to them, they will usually tell you that they will simply disallow every deduction and credit you took, which would force you to go to court and prove everything all over again - UNLESS, you give them an extension of time to pick around in your books some more.
I feel like the Soviets couldn't have come up with a more coercive bureaucracy. And this is an agency that has the power to take your money
This is all part of the reason why I'm studying tax law - to go get a job where my whole purpose in life will be to do battle with the beast and let people keep their money.
go to worldfreedom.com or google world freedom ventures. an interesting website for all of those who don't like taxes.
So sorry about that story, sounds like normal beauracracy to me
Night Twister • Veterans For McCain